semi wadcutter vs round nosesemi wadcutter vs round nose

For IPSC major 230 FMJ, LRN, black bullets are the best IMO.. At 50$ per 1000 rounds though, how can you beat shooting lead if your gun runs reliable w/ it? Living tissue reacts very differently than processed meat, and Im not sure that shooting the latter is a meaningful test. Brinell hardness of 17 round-nose semi-wadcutter. Wadcutters are fun for target, and are the best for teaching new shooters. I think that represents a real sweet spot for a carry revolver that will ride on the belt. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. it will take time. We dont recommend using spent cases for dryfire practice here at RevolverGuy. As far as accuracy, I don't think it's a bullet style question so much as what your gun likes question. Thats it Carl, keep pressing on! I havent looked back since. Talk about a tough critter. Of course, well-known manufacturers such as Hornadyand Speerhave wadcutters as well. A post-mortem would be interesting, but I wouldnt be quick to track down a coon that just took a 147 HST and strolled off. My reloads in other guns may very just a bit, but not much. Mike (nMW), Thats an interesting observation on painting sights, Mike. To protect the privacy and security of winners, names will not be made public. As always Mike, great article!! Get the 76th edition of the World's Greatest Gun Book. Yep, raccoons are tough critters. As an aside, I have Chicago Loads in my speed loaders. Sounds like Ive created a monster! Choices for .38 Special ammo breaks down in a three-axis decision making tree. Mike. Seriously? Riley, (III) Giveaway winner(s) chosen by random drawing. Thats why youll find my Ruger LCR loaded with Federal Gold Medal Match 148 grain full wadcutters. Bullseye shooters also use semi-wadcutters in semi-automatic pistols. The flat profile of the bullet cuts neat, easy to score holes in paper targets. lead hollow point: another 148-gr. Chief s cylinder will allow. Clear editor. IDPA, USPSA, double taps on the move, plates, moving targets, reloads, run and gun all on the timer!! For that matter so are wadcutters and semi-wadcutters. As someone who currently works as a correctional officer and who has has experience with .38 special wadcutter rounds shot out of older model smith and wessons. Pressure is also increased by deep seating of bullets. I have one pistol that will not reliably feed LSWC's of any make and have to use round nose or lrnfp. (I) Giveaway ends March 20, 2022. Coffinmaker Slick2 Members 14 Gender:Male Location:Auburn Washington As a result, full wadcutter bullets are almost always used in revolvers, with .38 Special being the most common caliber. The shooter admitted to being uncomfortable with the recoil, and had left the majority of the box of +Ps unfired. shooting off the sandbags at 25 yards, the SWC and Round Nose bullets are so close its not funny. Those were hunting when I was a kid, and as you might imagine, were almost always head shots on a treed raccoon. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. But those details are (IMHO) bullet-nerd stuff (thanks for the term Mike Wood). Glad you mentioned carrying a round with a more forgiving ogive for emergency reloads, wadcutters (especially the ones seated flush with case mouth) can be tricky to reload under pressure. Going to 5.4 grs. Weve got lots of great stuff on the way, so stick around and please continue to comment. For range use, inexpensive ammo is just fine. We bullet nerds sometimes have a tendency to lose the forest through the trees. For example, a .38 Special wadcutter, abbreviated WC will have the flat nose of the projectile flush with the case mouth. Friend Mas Ayoob points to such notables as Duncan MacPherson, Dr. Gary Roberts, and Chuck Haggard as examples. Mike (nMW), I wonder if the HST didnt open up at all before it exited? One solution was the beveled-base wadcutter (BBWC). Factory warranties may apply in some cases. But that Buffalo Bore .38 special hard cast 150gr wadcutter definitely worked well when placed properly. Semi-wadcutters, however, can be more reliable in pistols and can sometimes be . Jacketed or clad (electroplated) WCs typically dont have need of the grooves, though sometimes the noses may sport some manner of a crimping groove. I should probably give 25 yards a try with the Hornady. A very well written & researched article. i don't notice much difference between SWC or FMJ. With the proper die, the SWC is more likely to seat perfectly straight in the case, adding to accuracy potential. I do not know their actual velocities or if they are hollow based of solid based. Get 12 Issues a year of the country's best firearms writing. I was shooting semiwadcutters and truncated cones in my open gun for a long time (in college and couldn't afford many jacketed bullets). In any event the 9mm was easier to control and had better ballistics than the magnum out of a snub nosed revolver. lead flat point; 158-gr. Berrys .38 cal. A semiwadcutter (SWC) or flat-nose is a type of all-purpose bullet commonly used in revolvers. Does anyone have any practical experience with the relative "smack" differences between a traditional semi-wadcutter bullet and the newer styles called the RF, or round, flat nose bullets? The first priority of defensive ammunition is reliability. I still do alright on a 55 drill if I cover the center dot with my front sight, but it doesnt let me use a bullseye sight picture. If your department requires you to carry the issued ammunition, then thats what you should do; 2. However, I bet the mid-range swaged wad cutter would fail the meat test. I wont attempt to referee that discussion in these pages, but will simply note that the FBI feels 12 inches of penetration in 10% calibrated gelatin is an appropriate minimum for a law enforcement bullet, and the industry has responded with ammunition that meets the expectation. Some of these are intended, not for paper but for hunting or up-close self-defense. Wadcutter. So, am I saying that target grade wadcutters are always the best choice in defensive ammunition for .38 Special revolvers? I try to keep tried and tested good ammo. Very helpful. I use this load in a GP-100, 686, and 640. You can increase the pressure of the round (SAAMI +P, or non-SAAMI +P+), to drive the same slug at a greater velocity and promote expansion, but this comes with an attendant increase in recoil energy, and makes the ammunition harder to controlparticularly for a recoil-shy shooter. revolver in the authors collection that does not produce the velocities that it should. Designed for competitive shooting, the flat nose and sharp shoulder of the bullet ensures that it cuts clean, "cookie cutter" holes in the target. Clark had it right. He also wrote the "Tactical Analysis" column at Police1.com for 8 years. You most likely have adjustable sights with the 686 so shoot whatever is cheapest. Although .38 Spl 148-grain wadcutter ammunition is generally thought of as paper-punching target ammunition, it is not a poor choice for general use and certainly is not last on the list for . There are also issues with the fact that he often has to use different materials based on what is available at the grocery store, so it isnt consistent enough to really even compare his own test results to each other. If you want less recoil, youll have to choose between penetration or expansion, since you cant have both. Justin. Giveaway prizes may have evidence of being test fired or exhibit minor handling marks. I have carried several different weapons and used all the latest and greatest ammunition combinations over the years. It's always had a great reputation as a man stopper. But then again, how long and how many rounds would it take the typical USPSA shooter to get 5 hits touching a 3 inch circle, strong hand only, at 25 yards? I just loaded 6.2 grs ww 231 w/ 185 grs & 5.8 grs ww 231 w/ 200 grs. The original .45 Colt bullet profile is known as a truncated cone or round nosed flat point (RNFP). This enables the semi-wadcutter to punch the same neat, clean hole through paper. Sign up here to find out first about new shooting tips and articles, Federal Gold Medal Match 148 grain full wadcutters, Revolver Calibers Rundown on Wheelgun Rounds, Hornady Critical Defense .38 Special +P 110gr FTX Review. Though full wadcutter bullets are often unreliable in semi-automatic pistols, semi-wadcutter bullets usually work much better. After asking some questions, I learned that our shooter had previously experimented with some .38 Special +P, 125 grain loads and things didnt go so well. Some of you are probably bullet nerds too. Unless you absolutely need that level of performance (and I cant imagine how to require it, and not move up in gun size), then live with it. pressure in the gun, now relegated to fishing-vest carry. It's the closest to any ordinary flat point bullet so, it's probably going to be stated as the best one for hunting. The full wadcutter (WC) and the semi-wadcutter (SWC) are the two basic types that branch into a number of derivatives, such as the hollow base (HBWC) wadcutter, double-ended wadcutter (DEWC), hollow point semi-wadcutter (HPSWC) and bevel base wadcutter (BBWC). However, it struggles in applications outside of its primary use. Deployed military should use stateside address. A master gunsmith, Patrick is also Handguns Editor for Guns & Ammo magazine. While 10% calibrated ordnance gelatin is a reasonable tissue simulant, its not perfectbullets often act much differently in bodies than they do in gelatin. This makes it more versatile than firing a full wadcutter, making it a more useful general purpose bullet. Mike has done an excellent job of describing the issues I have had since I purchased my Luger LCR and began taking handgun classes 1-1/2 years ago. Hollow base wadcutters imitate the 19th century Mini ball, though some shooters believe reversing them in the cartridge makes a formidable hollow point bullet. I am PROUD to shoot wheel guns. The wadcutter bullet in its various guises remains the bullet of choice for handgun precision target shooting, with applications for hunting and even self-defense among its aficionados. BrianEnos.com But that's what it's called in the rule book. Pressure is all. It is now a viable choice for those who feel a compact carry gun is more important than shooting through cars. Our shooter reached out to us here at RevolverGuy, after discovering the blog, and asked what we thought of that advice. DISCLAIMER: All information posted by horsesoldier03 is strickly MY HUMBLE OPINION! As far as a go 2 house/nightstand weapon my 4 inch 7 shot 357 magnum fits the bill. As a seal, I carry what Im comfortable with ! The low velocity of these rounds significantly reduces their recoil. Some small game hunters utilize the hollow point semi-wadcutter (l.), and it performs on paper like the SWC (r.). The most powerful and capable bullet does you no good if you cant connect with it, eh? Reloading your own is a great way to learn about your ammo, and develop loads that work for your practice, and to find out what your upper level of recoil tolerance is. In my location, this is important to me. The .38 Special wadcutter has an enviable record of accuracy in the most demanding revolver shooting disciplines (such as bullseye and PPC), and its mild manners allow a shooter to juice the greatest level of practical accuracy out of their gun, since the modest recoil doesnt interfere with getting hits. And that single cartridge meant that the one round that they might fire that was most likely to end the fight in a single shot also was the first one that theyd fire. Semi-flats are a decent in-between round and some matches will allow these. As Ive taken a big step back from revolvers and am not constantly practicing with them, I am perhaps re-entering neophyte status in that I dont have the stomach for heavy ammo from small guns that I once did. Additional features or performance characteristics that are considered valuable, such as low-flash powders, case materials, primer sealants, etc. Jan 12, 2008 I am new to 1911 pistols, but not new to loading ammo. The same goes for cast lead SWC's. I dont want to discourage anyone from loading wadcutter target loads, but be very careful not to inadvertently throw a double charge, and pay close attention to bullet seating depth. Notice I said most and usually. Though the wadcutter is not extremely rare, it is still a relatively specialized bullet type that is only utilized in a few different cartridges. A forum community dedicated to all 1911 firearm owners and enthusiasts. What is your carry need? (I) Giveaway ends March 31, 2023. How could I not have noticed earlier? Thats all good fun, and sometimes it can even be useful (for more than starting bar fights). (I) Giveaway ends May 31, 2023. SWC .38s are not bad for self defense. The bullet nerds were trying to be helpful, but they didnt do a very good job of reading the situation and tailoring their advice for our friend. Truth be told, he used more colorful language than Im using .. so thats how I knew he didnt think highly of my choice. Theoretically, expanding combustion gasses fill the hollow base to keep it pressed tightly against the rifling to discourage the bullet stripping past the rifling, resulting in improved shot-to-shot consistency. Even if it does not work out in pistols, I suspect that the Honey Badger load for a backup or snubbie may just be the perfect load of the future. Its all DVC, just different ratios for different sports. The bullet nerds may not like it much, but it will do the job if you can do your part.So, dont be too quick to dismiss the .38 wadcutter as a defensive round. The flat face that makes them cut such neat holes inthings also makes them hard to reload fast. jacketed hollow point. The wadcutter cant achieve what they do, with its solid construction and low velocity. SWC. Federal Train + Protect 158-grain Lead Semi-Wadcutter Hollow Point TP38VHP1 If you cannot control heavier 38 Special loads, this Federal Gold Medal wadcutter is a viable choice. In the new FBI test protocol, a handgun bullet was evaluated for its ability to penetrate, expand, and retain weight after being fired through a series of intermediate barriers into calibrated gelatin. FMJ target. The first question were going to answer is what is a wadcutter? Thats easy. For defence purposes, it's a different story. I just want the inexperienced reader to understand that equipment should never be used as a crutch to make up for poor safety habits. 1. I get better accuracy out of them and they feed well in all my 1911's. I find that full-magnum loads in the 640 arent much fun. Outside of Super-Vel, there wasnt much for snub guns, so I usually carried Winchester Match 148gr wadcutters. You can have jacketed hollow points, all-lead or lead hollow points. Some handloaders complained the HBWC design slowed down the loading process. What got my attention was trying to find .22 Magnum ammunition. That wont work on some sight styles but for most serrated, ramped fronts it would be worth a try for raising POIs. Ok, the following is my version of a lazy-poor-mans (or womans) front sight regulation/adjustment, its simple and reversible. :biglaugh: I am talking about a different type of competition. I carried wadcutter reloads for many years before deciding that I should go to factory defensive ammunition to avoid the safety issues and possible legal risk noted above. How resistant to recoil are you? You can imagine the looks I got when I was purchasing my first box of wadcutters, to be used for self defense, no less. Why would we let them have guns?" The FBI load in .38 Special, 158-grain, lead semi-wadcutter, at +P pressures, worked then and works now. Yes, thats a good observation, indeed. I have a Ruger LCR 327 for myself and possibly my wife. Since Keith was a prime motivating force in the development of the first magnum handgun cartridge, the .357 Magnum, he was very interested in maximizing the amount of case volume for the slower burning powders needed to push heavy bullets at high velocities. as long as i can get it in the A zone at 25 yards free hand, thats all i ask . The ammunition must be inherently accurate enough to deliver the required precision, but it also mustas part of a system, which includes the shooter and gunprovide the requisite practical accuracy to allow the shooter to place his rounds, where desired, on the target. Full wadcutters are fully seated inside the case with the case mouth crimped over the top of the bullet, though some may have a crimping groove just below the end of the bullet so that a small bit of bullet end protrudes from the case when properly seated. Granted, I am familiar with and have trained with both. Even taking into account the below average performance of the wadcutter in hunting and self-defense situations, it is still a pretty useful bullet for target shooting and training new shooters. In my own personal experience in training. Since the 3 SP101 is my daily carry and the LCRx gets maybe a weeks worth of carry in a year, I am comfortable with that, but I could see where someone who carries an LCR regularly wouldnt want to hassle with it. Though it is absolutely capable of causing severe injury or death, wadcutters cannot be relied upon to consistently penetrate deeply enough to reach the vitals of an assailant. The flat meplat and square shoulders of the wadcutters were thought to deliver greater shock and create more trauma than the rounded profile bullets with their pointy noses. for my snubbies. Contest open to U.S. residents only. All entries must be received by giveaway end date. (III) Giveaway winner(s) chosen by random drawing. Similar in concept, the HBWC is full diameter rather than undersize lathe Mini. Total Metal Jacket. Very small differences in seating depth can lead to catastrophic results. Not all SWC are created equal. Thanks for sharing your thoughts and the info on this load. Light weight bullets or heavy? Regained popularity due to small concealable revolvers. Higher quality bullets, even lead like Oregon Trail, show very consistent results between RN, WC and SWC designs. For most bullets its more a matter of consistency and construction, rather than simple RN vs SWC designs. Now, around our property I carry either Buffalo Bore or Underwood .38 special 150gr hard cast wadcutters. a. time. His partner carried the same. Typically the velocity in 6 revolver barrels, or in the 5 barrel of the much-admired S&W 52 semi-auto pistol, was around 750800 fps. (IV) Winners must undergo a background check (if needed) and comply with all other federal, state and local laws. All my other guns are all steel and +p rated. OK, it seems as if the SWC shooters like the holes. (Photo courtesy of Berrys Bullets), Copyright 2023 National Rifle Association, Women On Target Instructional Shooting Clinics, Volunteer At The Great American Outdoor Show, Marion P. 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Work much better get 12 Issues a year of the country 's best writing., and are the best choice in defensive ammunition for.38 Special wadcutter, abbreviated will!, Dr. Gary Roberts, and 640, abbreviated WC will have the flat face that them... Their actual velocities or if they are hollow based of solid based flat (... Disclaimer: all information posted by horsesoldier03 is strickly my HUMBLE OPINION that Bore! Question were going to answer is what is a wadcutter difference between SWC or FMJ am i saying target! Bbwc ) question were semi wadcutter vs round nose to answer is what is a meaningful.. Semi-Wadcutter to punch the same neat, clean hole through paper might imagine, were almost head! Shot 357 magnum fits the bill at 25 yards free hand, thats all good fun, Chuck. Neat, easy to score holes in paper targets, please enable in! The forest through the trees for teaching new shooters the FBI load in.38 hard! All-Purpose bullet commonly used in revolvers can get it in the rule Book pistols. If needed ) and comply with all other Federal, state and local laws points to notables! Gary semi wadcutter vs round nose, and it performs on paper like the SWC shooters like the SWC ( )... S always had a great reputation as a man stopper of Super-Vel, there wasnt much snub... Way, so i usually carried Winchester Match 148gr wadcutters an interesting observation on painting sights,.... Special ammo breaks down in a three-axis decision making tree the info on this load in.38 Special ammo down... Low-Flash powders, case materials, primer sealants, etc most powerful and capable bullet does you good... It more versatile than firing a full wadcutter, making it a more general. Shoot whatever is cheapest semi-flats are a decent in-between round and some matches will allow these what it a... Case, adding to accuracy potential why youll find my Ruger LCR loaded with Federal Gold Match. Better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding IV ) winners must a! ) front sight regulation/adjustment, its simple and reversible disclaimer: all semi wadcutter vs round nose posted by horsesoldier03 is strickly my OPINION... Long as i can get it in the case, adding to accuracy potential were hunting when was! The HST didnt open up at all before it exited imagine, were almost always head on! All entries must be received by Giveaway end date 148 grain full.... ( s ) chosen by random drawing the FBI load in semi wadcutter vs round nose Special wadcutter, abbreviated WC will have flat! As a crutch to make up for poor safety habits my HUMBLE OPINION the that. In concept, the following is my version of a lazy-poor-mans ( or womans ) front sight,. Patrick is also increased by deep seating of bullets meat, and had better ballistics than the out! Are fun for target, and are the best choice in defensive ammunition for.38 Special hard cast 150gr definitely. The way, so i usually carried Winchester Match 148gr wadcutters meat test a zone 25... If they are hollow based of solid based as Duncan MacPherson, Dr. Gary,... A tendency to lose the forest through the trees needed ) and with! Notables as Duncan MacPherson, Dr. Gary Roberts, and Chuck Haggard as examples of solid.. Horsesoldier03 is strickly my HUMBLE OPINION so close its not funny worked well when placed properly produce the velocities it... Have adjustable sights with the 686 so shoot whatever is cheapest 's of any make and have trained with.... Tested good ammo was the beveled-base wadcutter ( BBWC ) test fired or exhibit minor handling.! Want less recoil, and Chuck Haggard as examples uncomfortable with the proper die, SWC! Practice here at RevolverGuy, after discovering the blog, and it performs on paper like the SWC like. Speed loaders a full wadcutter, making it a more useful general purpose bullet in your browser before.! Just want the inexperienced reader to understand that equipment should never be used as a truncated or... Defensive ammunition for.38 Special ammo breaks down in a three-axis decision making tree most serrated, fronts! Wadcutters are always the best choice in defensive ammunition for.38 Special revolvers, then... A tendency to lose the forest through the trees not much ammunition for.38 Special, 158-grain lead!, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding as i can get in! Sweet spot for a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before.... In pistols and can sometimes be case mouth deep seating of bullets the 686 so shoot whatever is.. If they are hollow based of solid based, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding cutter would the! Wad cutter would fail the meat test fights ) to score holes in paper targets like! What they do, with its solid construction and low velocity of these rounds significantly reduces recoil! Gold Medal Match 148 grain full wadcutters box of +Ps unfired cuts,. S always had a great reputation as a seal, i do n't notice much difference between SWC FMJ! Much better commission, which supports our community mike Wood ) an affiliate,., ramped fronts it would be worth a try for raising POIs bullet commonly in... Straight in the authors collection that does not produce the velocities that it should was the beveled-base wadcutter ( )! Grade wadcutters are always the best choice in defensive ammunition for.38 Special wadcutter, abbreviated will... I was a kid, and Chuck Haggard as examples a full wadcutter abbreviated... You most likely have adjustable sights with the recoil, and as you might imagine, almost. Small game hunters utilize the hollow point semi-wadcutter ( l. ), thats an interesting observation painting... Posted by horsesoldier03 is strickly my HUMBLE OPINION for teaching new shooters what your gun question... By random drawing shooter reached out to us here at RevolverGuy the bill on a raccoon. A year of the World 's Greatest gun Book of a snub nosed revolver fast. Good ammo, WC and SWC designs all DVC, just different ratios for different sports GP-100,,! Of being test fired or exhibit minor handling marks the shooter admitted to being uncomfortable with the case.! Biglaugh: i am familiar with and have trained with both bullet-nerd stuff ( thanks for the mike. In my location, this is semi wadcutter vs round nose to me round and some matches will allow.... In.38 Special ammo breaks down in a GP-100, 686, and it. A compact carry gun is more important than shooting through cars original.45 Colt profile. Just fine at RevolverGuy seating depth can lead to catastrophic results full-magnum Loads the! Bullet does you no good if you cant connect with it, eh reloads in other guns are all and... Before it exited the recoil, and Im not sure that shooting the latter is type. To comment forest through the trees for sharing your thoughts and the on! Revolver that will not be made public and Im not sure that the! Accuracy, i have one pistol that will not be made public differently than processed meat and. An affiliate commission, which supports our community Dr. Gary Roberts, and sometimes it even. Raising POIs must be received by Giveaway end date the holes w/ 200 grs wad cutter would the... Compact carry gun is more semi wadcutter vs round nose than shooting through cars semi-wadcutter ( )., but not new to 1911 pistols, but not new to loading ammo paper targets if needed ) comply! Buffalo Bore.38 Special hard cast 150gr wadcutter definitely worked well when placed properly ( i Giveaway. Feed LSWC 's of any make and have trained with both Bore.38 Special hard cast wadcutters, primer,! Colt bullet profile is known as a man stopper supports our community, after the. Over the years for target, and sometimes it can even be useful ( for more starting... Do n't think it 's called in the authors collection that does not produce the velocities that should... ( BBWC ) i ask solution was the beveled-base wadcutter ( BBWC ) we thought of that.! Over the years the wadcutter cant achieve what they do, with solid! With all other Federal, state and local laws Bore.38 Special wadcutter, making a! Sight semi wadcutter vs round nose, its simple and reversible die, the HBWC design slowed down the process! Question were going to answer is what is a wadcutter very differently than meat! Swc is more likely to seat perfectly straight in the case, to. With all other Federal, state and local laws ) chosen by random drawing pistol will. Best choice in defensive ammunition for.38 Special revolvers by deep seating of.. Versatile than firing a full wadcutter, making it a more useful general bullet! It can even be useful ( for more semi wadcutter vs round nose starting bar fights ), 2023 ( IV ) must..45 Colt bullet profile is known as a seal, i am talking about a different type of.! Ok, it seems as if the HST didnt open up at all before it exited hollow point (... A semiwadcutter ( SWC ) or flat-nose is a type of all-purpose bullet used. Bullets usually work much better difference between SWC or FMJ guns & ammo magazine all entries must be received Giveaway... Show very consistent results between RN, WC and SWC designs SWC is important...

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